Return of the Cesc

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Return of the Cesc

Post by Jonathan Prendergast on Fri Jun 15, 2012 1:12 pm

I can't be bothered following the mini dramas that occur on Twitter...but

What's this nonsense about whether Cesc is welcome back or not? What sparked it? Is he not happy at Barca now Pep has left?

I can't believe some are suggesting that Nasri behaved well during the transfer saga, but Cesc betrayed the club? What a joke.

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Re: Return of the Cesc

Post by Meshaal on Fri Jun 15, 2012 6:08 pm

Would happily take him back - doubt we can afford him though.

Maybe we can have him back on loan?

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Re: Return of the Cesc

Post by Sami Rockfeller on Fri Jun 15, 2012 6:21 pm

I would take Cesc back in the blink of an eye.

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Re: Return of the Cesc

Post by Mario on Fri Jun 15, 2012 8:59 pm

Those who say Cesc 'betrayed' the club have accused him of going on strike to force the move to Barcelona through. I've heard that mentioned a few times.

I guess that's what started the debate about 'welcoming him back' not because we actually have a chance of signing him back.

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Re: Return of the Cesc

Post by Alex Hadjicharalampous on Fri Jun 15, 2012 9:43 pm

Jonathan Prendergast wrote:I can't be bothered following the mini dramas that occur on Twitter...but

What's this nonsense about whether Cesc is welcome back or not? What sparked it? Is he not happy at Barca now Pep has left?

I can't believe some are suggesting that Nasri behaved well during the transfer saga, but Cesc betrayed the club? What a joke.

Nasri did behave better during the transfer saga. He played for us against Liverpool in the league before he left and had a good game. Despite the fact that he is a despicable git, he was professional until the end. In stark contrast to Fabregas who wouldn't play for us because 'his head's not in the right place' (according to Wenger) and because he was 'injured' (even though he played in Barcelona's super cup final against Real Madrid almost immediately after the transfer went through).

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Re: Return of the Cesc

Post by Zaid Derweesh on Fri Jun 15, 2012 10:07 pm

Not sure Nasri had a good game - 9 turnovers and generally not being effective.

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Re: Return of the Cesc

Post by Alex Hadjicharalampous on Fri Jun 15, 2012 10:24 pm

No one was effective in that game, but I felt he was the best of a bad bunch. Either way, the point still stands.

Just because Fabregas is more likeable doesn't mean he behaved better.

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Re: Return of the Cesc

Post by Vanig Bostanian on Sat Jun 16, 2012 12:13 am

I personally wouldn't welcome him back. Not because I hate him, I celebrated his goal against Italy as if he still was our player, but because I don't want people with his attitude at the club. I want people with Benayoun or Arteta attitude (with the quality of Cesc).

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Re: Return of the Cesc

Post by Subrat Koirala on Sat Jun 16, 2012 1:18 am

I remember hearing this somewhere and probably it applies to this case:

bringing back a player who left under certain circumstances is like getting back with your ex-girlfriend. For a few months, its all well and good, but then you start to realise why you broke up in the first place.

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Re: Return of the Cesc

Post by Will.sheng on Sat Jun 16, 2012 8:17 am

Subrat Koirala wrote:I remember hearing this somewhere and probably it applies to this case:

bringing back a player who left under certain circumstances is like getting back with your ex-girlfriend. For a few months, its all well and good, but then you start to realise why you broke up in the first place.

Deep...

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Re: Return of the Cesc

Post by Jonathan Prendergast on Sat Jun 16, 2012 7:17 pm

Alex Hadjicharalampous wrote:
Jonathan Prendergast wrote:I can't be bothered following the mini dramas that occur on Twitter...but

What's this nonsense about whether Cesc is welcome back or not? What sparked it? Is he not happy at Barca now Pep has left?

I can't believe some are suggesting that Nasri behaved well during the transfer saga, but Cesc betrayed the club? What a joke.

Nasri did behave better during the transfer saga. He played for us against Liverpool in the league before he left and had a good game. Despite the fact that he is a despicable git, he was professional until the end. In stark contrast to Fabregas who wouldn't play for us because 'his head's not in the right place' (according to Wenger) and because he was 'injured' (even though he played in Barcelona's super cup final against Real Madrid almost immediately after the transfer went through).

Nasri forced a move out.

While Cesc never forced Wenger's hand. In the end, it was continuous Barca and media pressure that got to Arsenal and Wenger, which made Cesc's position untenable. The pressure started 2 years prior to the eventual move, and when we went through the season creating high expectations, then falling so badly, losing a cup final against a team that got relegated, and falling so far off the league leaders at the end, there was no other option.

Nasri first went for United, then went for City. He didn't want to move to a particular club, or return to his home club, just wanted to get out. He only played the Liverpool game, after missing earlier games, as it looked the City deal would also fall over. We were desperately short of players at that stage too.

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Re: Return of the Cesc

Post by Mario on Sat Jun 16, 2012 7:57 pm

Jonathan Prendergast wrote:

Nasri forced a move out.

While Cesc never forced Wenger's hand.


At least not publicly.

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Re: Return of the Cesc

Post by Jonathan Prendergast on Sat Jun 16, 2012 9:02 pm

If Cesc did do it publicly, we would have gotten even less for him.

Also, Nasri lied for a year about why he was not extending his contract.

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Re: Return of the Cesc

Post by Alex Hadjicharalampous on Sat Jun 16, 2012 9:42 pm

So Fabregas, with 4 years left on his contract didn't force a move? Do you really believe that? Arsenal had no reason to sell their best player and captain with 4 years left on his contract, none at all. The pressure and the failures have nothing to do with Arsenal having to sell a player... unless the player really wanted to leave. Which means he forced the move.

You talk as if the fact Fabregas wanted to go to his home club gives him a free pass in all this whereas Nasri not knowing where he wanted to go makes him out to be so much worse. They both wanted to leave Arsenal, they both were not committed, but at least Nasri played while he was still under contract. Therefore Nasri behaved better.

As for lying, that's ludicrous. Would you say RVP was lying about his contract if he decided to leave this summer? Do you have any quotes from Nasri saying he was going to sign the contract and stay?


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Re: Return of the Cesc

Post by Jenson Pais on Sat Jun 16, 2012 9:43 pm

Jonathan Prendergast wrote:If Cesc did do it publicly, we would have gotten even less for him.

Also, Nasri lied for a year about why he was not extending his contract.

No way. I like Cesc as a player. But I didn't like how he behaved. He wanted to go only to Barca so we never got a good value out of him. Also I'll never forget his back pass to the Barca player. Evil or Very Mad

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Re: Return of the Cesc

Post by Jonathan Prendergast on Sat Jun 16, 2012 10:52 pm

Alex Hadjicharalampous wrote:So Fabregas, with 4 years left on his contract didn't force a move? Do you really believe that? Arsenal had no reason to sell their best player and captain with 4 years left on his contract, none at all. The pressure and the failures have nothing to do with Arsenal having to sell a player... unless the player really wanted to leave. Which means he forced the move.

You talk as if the fact Fabregas wanted to go to his home club gives him a free pass in all this whereas Nasri not knowing where he wanted to go makes him out to be so much worse. They both wanted to leave Arsenal, they both were not committed, but at least Nasri played while he was still under contract. Therefore Nasri behaved better.

As for lying, that's ludicrous. Would you say RVP was lying about his contract if he decided to leave this summer? Do you have any quotes from Nasri saying he was going to sign the contract and stay?


History is being re-written. I remember what was happening at the time, and all the discussions on the forum. The way things had occured, over 2 draining years, everyone on here thought he should leave also.

This is what I believe: Cesc said to Wenger (and publically) he would one day like to go back Barca. But he would never force a move, and would like to win some trophies with Arsenal. But no doubt, week after week over 2 years of Barca players speaking publicly about his Barca DNA, the players putting a Barca shirt on him etc etc, while having their most successful period ever. It weighed on Cesc, Wenger and the club.

The move took 2 years to happen. It was not him that did actions over those 2 years that made the move happen. Maybe he had some influence on bringing it to a head when it needed to.

As for lying, Nasri said he wanted to prove himself before signing a new contract, as if he owed it to the club. It is now clear he wanted to run down his contract to make him more attractive to the next club.

RVP has pretty much been silent.

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Re: Return of the Cesc

Post by Alex Hadjicharalampous on Sun Jun 17, 2012 12:19 am

I don't really care about what it looked like at the time, only what it actually was. Fabregas forced the move, and this is undeniable. He had 4 years to go on his contract, he was the club's captain and arguably best player and Arsenal Football Club were under no obligation to sell him.

But they did. Why would they do that? Because Barcelona players kept talking about him, because they put a shirt on him during the World Cup? Of course not, that has nothing to do with anything. It's because Fabregas made it clear that he no longer wanted to play for Arsenal and would only move to Barcelona, forcing the club to sell him and for a significantly less amount of money than he actually would be worth if he was willing to go somewhere other than Barcelona.

If he was willing to stay and be professional, you better believe Arsenal wouldn't sell him. But he made his choice, decided to feign injury and whatnot and eventually left, leaving the club in a mess.

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Re: Return of the Cesc

Post by Jenks1981 on Sun Jun 17, 2012 2:22 am

We have a better "team" and a better "squad" togetherness now I think so wouldn't have him back. He looked so pissed when he scored the other night, clearly teasy because he was benched, his ego is pretty massive and his time has been and gone, would not want him back.

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Re: Return of the Cesc

Post by Jonathan Prendergast on Sun Jun 17, 2012 10:23 am

Jenks1981 wrote:We have a better "team" and a better "squad" togetherness now I think so wouldn't have him back. He looked so pissed when he scored the other night, clearly teasy because he was benched, his ego is pretty massive and his time has been and gone, would not want him back.

I agree the team has better togetherness and is a better team now.

It shows that it was a mistake to have him captain, and to be so short on mature players.

That said, with a more solid defence and more depth in midfield now, I think we have a better squad that could make the most of Cesc's talents.

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Re: Return of the Cesc

Post by Jonathan Prendergast on Sun Jun 17, 2012 10:33 am

Alex Hadjicharalampous wrote:I don't really care about what it looked like at the time, only what it actually was. Fabregas forced the move, and this is undeniable. He had 4 years to go on his contract, he was the club's captain and arguably best player and Arsenal Football Club were under no obligation to sell him.

But they did. Why would they do that? Because Barcelona players kept talking about him, because they put a shirt on him during the World Cup? Of course not, that has nothing to do with anything. It's because Fabregas made it clear that he no longer wanted to play for Arsenal and would only move to Barcelona, forcing the club to sell him and for a significantly less amount of money than he actually would be worth if he was willing to go somewhere other than Barcelona.

If he was willing to stay and be professional, you better believe Arsenal wouldn't sell him. But he made his choice, decided to feign injury and whatnot and eventually left, leaving the club in a mess.

How can you say you don't care what it looked like, and only what it actually was, then write 3 paragraphs based on speculation and what it looked like?

You are forgetting that we were all surprised that Cesc stayed the previous year, under such pressure.

And you cannot ignore media and other pressures, and discount their ability to influence such situations. Media pressure can change governments, so surely they can play a big part in the transfer of a football player.

When comparing the Nasri and Cesc transfers, you are concentrating only on the final week of each move. Think back to who instigated the move, what they said during speculation. Transfers can take a long time, 2 years for Cesc, from start to end. You are only concentrating on the final week of both of these transfers.

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Re: Return of the Cesc

Post by Jonathan Prendergast on Sun Jun 17, 2012 5:50 pm

Here's another theory. At some stage in June/July last year Wenger started a discussion with Barcelona. I bet once Cesc heard any word of any sort of discussion, it would have been the tipping point, and no looking back. He wanted to be loyal to Arsenal, but he had a huge factor pulling him home. That is probably why he didn't train in pre-season leading up to the transfer.

The situation with Cesc was unique. Barca had just won about 11 trophies in the season just gone, but when they signed him, 30-40k fans turned up to celebrate. Incredible.


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Re: Return of the Cesc

Post by John Foxall on Mon Jun 18, 2012 12:14 am

I thank him for his time at Arsenal and plenty of good memories but for once it was a no way back situation. Everyone knew that if he wanted to go he would get his way sooner or later.

I don't think he's the ultimate to death type of leader, even excusing his injuries in his final seasons.

It was depressing to hear him say that he thought Barcelona deserved to win against Chelsea. Just like in our many near misses in the title run and failure to win important matches, merit doesn't come into it. Either you do what is needed to win or you don't. He certainly has a bit of an ego and rightfully isn't a certain starter for Spain. He still needs to work to fit in.

Xavi and Iniesta are the irreplaceable players in the Spain and Barcelona sides. The rest are very good players but that duo are the players who made those teams successful by directing what the side did best. Fabregas looked like a problematic signing this season, a little bit disruptive where Barcelona's players had fit in perfectly before. I guess that's the difficult of having more money than they know what to do with!

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Re: Return of the Cesc

Post by Jonathan Prendergast on Wed May 29, 2013 2:50 pm

Speculation is mounting on a United move for Cesc.

ESPC Article

Apparently they 'understand' that United have been in touch.

The big question is, is there really a buy back clause for Arsenal in his Barca contract? Is it confirmed?

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Re: Return of the Cesc

Post by Vanig Bostanian on Wed May 29, 2013 3:08 pm

Never mind what I said earlier in the thread. I'd welcome him back. Him going to United would only mean that United are the Bayern and Barca of England and we are Malaga/Sevilla/Schalke

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Re: Return of the Cesc

Post by Michael Foster on Wed May 29, 2013 8:00 pm

Too right I would welcome him 'home' arteta won't have that much life left in him for one....and to be honest with inesta and ol shav still gonna be around for a good few seasons he will still be a bench player......he should come back.....regular game time and we could do with him.....

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Re: Return of the Cesc

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