Man Utd Post Match - WTF Arsene

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Post by Justin Chew on Mon Jan 23, 2012 4:15 pm

Some panic buys now please? can't bear to see Arshavin or Djourou playing for us anymore.

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Post by kique.canto on Mon Jan 23, 2012 6:28 pm

Why does everyone keep saying Rosicky was terrible? I didn't think he played bad at all.
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Post by John Foxall on Mon Jan 23, 2012 6:44 pm

We are one point worse off after 22 games than in 05/06. Urgghhh


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Post by John Foxall on Mon Jan 23, 2012 6:51 pm

Jonathan Prendergast wrote:For all the criticism of Wenger, his lack of ambition, and poor transfers:

We wanted Cahill - We got Mertersacker
We wanted Parker - We go Arteta
We wanted Schwarzer/Reina - We got Szczechny

We also doubted the Koscielny and Ox signings, and now they are 2 of our favourite players.

No-one doubted the Ox signing, everyone was just more worried about first-team signings at the time. It's clear how talented he is, but a player to rotate with Walcott/Gervinho was needed earlier in the season, not now. We've had to wait a long time to even see him as a sub in the league, bar Wenger's weird habit of throwing in youngsters to Man Utd games, but not trusting them for easier appearances even as a sub in the league.

This goes beyond his transfers, it's all about his ability to do whatever it takes to get us to improve, get something from a vital game when necessary etc. We're just not professional enough atm, hence our ability to throw away a point having got back to level terms in the past two games. That defending for Welbeck's goal was just woeful. The biggest criticism that can be made of Wenger in the past few years is that he has failed to provide a convincing strategy when we don't have the ball. It may well be a case that he isn't interested in that, but in that case he's not doing his job properly. Other teams can cope reasonably well with makeshift backlines etc, we can't. Other team can adapt their tactics, performances to the occasion, we seemingly can't. Other teams simply are fitter and have more athletic first XIs, bar a few individuals we don't.

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Post by jason.mandryk on Mon Jan 23, 2012 9:49 pm

I think that sub was a real shift in Wenger's fortunes, numbnuts board or otherwise. From this point on, he is just keeping the team for the next manager. He has taken this club as far as he can in terms of results on the pitch, he's alienating an increasing number of supporters and RVP's reaction was hopefully a one-off knee jerk rather than a signal of deeper discontent.

Getting into the top four with this side will be a minor miracle, we could easily finish 6th if Liverpool weren't so inept and still might anyway. Facing AC Milan in the CL and even in the FA Cup, Alex McLeish has beaten us with a worse squad than he currently has. Even if we beat Villa and AC Milan, we will not be winning either of those competitions, not by a long shot.

I also find it fascinating that nobody commented that we had a major advantage going forward, the experienced Arshavin against Valencia at right back..we should have been taking advantage of that mismatch, but instead, got the tables turned on us.

Arsenal.com helpfully inform me today of Wenger's view "We played our game but weren't rewarded". He is right...the reward for playing "our" game against United should have been the hiding that we so nearly got.

Dark times and still waiting for Statto to tell us when the last time Arsenal lost three straight in the league was...
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Post by ChippyBrady on Mon Jan 23, 2012 10:10 pm

How did we nearly get a hiding? I have to yet to watch any highlights but from being there I felt that Man Utd threatened our goal very little and we probably could have come away with at least a point if some of our chances were taken.
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Post by waelt on Mon Jan 23, 2012 10:18 pm

jason.mandryk wrote:

Dark times and still waiting for Statto to tell us when the last time Arsenal lost three straight in the league was...

Last time we lost 3 straight in the league was in 2007, so not long ago

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Post by kegan on Mon Jan 23, 2012 10:46 pm

Wenger for me is to blame for Jack Wilshere being injured. I tell you exactly why. We knew, he knew, Wilshere was suffering from an injury. He played in the Emirates Cup on the Saturday, so being logical, Wilshere would NOT play on the Sunday, especially as Wenger knew Jack had a problem. But then, Wenger also plays him the very NEXT day on the Sunday, resulting in Jack going off injured & still missing because of that.

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Post by Mike York on Mon Jan 23, 2012 11:12 pm

Went into this season believing we had good squad depth but couldn't expect 8+ defenders to get injured, and having no full backs is hurting us every game. Other teams know where to target and Man Utd targeted Djourou all first half, then when Yennaris came on they didn't go down that side nearly as much.

We didn't play well but neither did Man Utd. I expected a draw before the game so not overly suprised at a narrow loss. Both their goals were very avoidable and we created a few very good chances in the second half. I am still in shock at how Van Persie missed from a few yards out after the Rosicky pass.

On the substitution I never thought the Ox would have played the whole game. He has barely played this season and probably isn't as fit as the others, and it is a big match for an 18 year old, but I do think Benayoun should have been bought on instead. Arshavin lost his magic a while back whilst Benayoun actually works for the team and that is what we needed. If the Ox was suffering cramp, fair enough, but if not I am amazed he went off and not Theo.

According to Wenger...

"I can understand that the fans are upset about the substitution, especially when it doesn't work, but he had started to fatigue," Wenger said of his decision to substitute the former Southampton winger.

"He was sick in the week. Arshavin is captain of the Russia national team. You have an 18-year-old kid making his first Premier League start and a player who's captain of his country and they are querying the substitution?"

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/16674180.stm
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Post by Jonathan Prendergast on Mon Jan 23, 2012 11:30 pm

Agree with all of that Mike.
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Post by Mike York on Mon Jan 23, 2012 11:37 pm

You're a good man Mr. Prendergast Smile
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Post by Michael Foster on Tue Jan 24, 2012 1:16 am

I too agree with that but what I don't is what AW was saying about the sub of AA and that he is the captain of the Russian national well sir AW do you not seam to notice ok he is the captain but...really does he really need to be constantly playing this shit??? Does it justify he has been awfull for god knows how long now because he is captain???...might in your book Wenger but not in mine...

AA should be shipped out its clear to everybody he is not gonna turn overnight into a blinding player again...clear out the dead wood Wenger...Christ just get on with it...
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Post by Joey Schwab on Tue Jan 24, 2012 2:29 am

Chippy your post on the last page is excellent. Mario, same to you.

I can understand the frustration 100% with Arsene and the substitution. I am alot more lenient with him than some (maybe even most, now) of our fans and will give him the benefit of the doubt about Chambo being fatigued/cramping/what have you. And if we're being honest, Benayoun was awful in his last game for us. I think Arsene was going for the win, and let's not forget that Arshavin has been, at his best, a big game player.

Did it go wrong? Absolutey. Was the response from the fans a disgrace? Yes. Abusing Andrei before he even had a touch on the ball was never going to help anything. Chanting at Wenger when drawing 1-1 at home with the defending champions? Give me a break. I know the frustration is deeper than just yesterday but what exactly do these people hope to achieve?
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Post by jason.mandryk on Tue Jan 24, 2012 3:22 am

ChippyBrady7 wrote:How did we nearly get a hiding? I have to yet to watch any highlights but from being there I felt that Man Utd threatened our goal very little and we probably could have come away with at least a point if some of our chances were taken.

We actually could have come away with three points. But if United had been more productive with their first half incision and penetration, we could easily have been dead and buried by the half; I don't see this team as having the strength to come down from a couple of goals down.

The substitution was a perfectly sensible one to make, even if the Ox wasn't strained/injured/exhausted. Giving AA his 15 minutes to try something on is not a terrible idea. However, is it just my current pessimism regarding Wenger, or it is actually the case that his tactical substitutions (especially later in matches) tend to backfire more than succeed in recent years? I've never thought that Wenger was particularly good at making in-game adjustments; he is a much better strategist than tactician.
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Post by Pat McMenimen on Tue Jan 24, 2012 4:30 am

Is anyone 100% convinced that Chamberlain would have made that tackle anyways..?

Also, I am probably more upset with Djourou not closing Nani down than Arshavin missing a tackle that lead to the ball being pinged around our 6 yard box...
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Post by Vijay Saibola on Tue Jan 24, 2012 4:56 am

Wenger has lost the plot long back. Its just that people are coming to realize it at different times and the numbers against him will continue to grow.

He deserves the sack just for all the shit transfer windows for years, not the doing what the team needs and Larseminute.com deals.

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Post by Vijay Saibola on Tue Jan 24, 2012 5:00 am

"I am 30 years in this job, I make 50,000 subsitutions."

Anybody else notice that he is using the "30 years" card more often recently. Sounds like the end is nigh.

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Post by Pat McMenimen on Tue Jan 24, 2012 5:01 am

"Wenger has lost the plot long back."

Except for when he had found the plot again during the run up to these last defeats.
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Post by Vijay Saibola on Tue Jan 24, 2012 5:05 am

Pat McMenimen wrote:
Except for when he had found the plot again during the run up to these last defeats.

Only deluded fans would think we had the plot. We see the same story every season, how the team implodes in the 2nd half of season. Only disappointment and Wenger keeps selling the future.

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Post by Pat McMenimen on Tue Jan 24, 2012 6:25 am

[quote="Vijay Saibola"]
Pat McMenimen wrote:

Only deluded fans would think we had the plot. We see the same story every season, how the team implodes in the 2nd half of season. Only disappointment and Wenger keeps selling the future.

I'm just pointing out that there weren't many "he's lost the plot" cries when we were climbing our way back up the table.

OK, I am done now.
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Post by Hisham El Mawan on Tue Jan 24, 2012 6:54 am

[quote="Pat McMenimen"]
Vijay Saibola wrote:
Pat McMenimen wrote:

Only deluded fans would think we had the plot. We see the same story every season, how the team implodes in the 2nd half of season. Only disappointment and Wenger keeps selling the future.

I'm just pointing out that there weren't many "he's lost the plot" cries when we were climbing our way back up the table.

OK, I am done now.

Maybe Vijay's deluded..

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Post by Jonathan Prendergast on Tue Jan 24, 2012 7:08 am

Pat McMenimen wrote:Is anyone 100% convinced that Chamberlain would have made that tackle anyways..?

Also, I am probably more upset with Djourou not closing Nani down than Arshavin missing a tackle that lead to the ball being pinged around our 6 yard box...

Chamberlain would probably have been 30 minutes up the field rather than back tracking Valencia. Vermaelen should have come up to cover/support Arsharvin in that 1 on 1 with Valencia rather than sit back in the middle. I don't blame Arsharvin at all for that.
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Post by John Foxall on Tue Jan 24, 2012 7:16 am

Pat McMenimen wrote:"Wenger has lost the plot long back."

Except for when he had found the plot again during the run up to these last defeats.

We've had strong runs in the past few seasons but always mixed in with bad patches. Too many to be closer to the title etc etc.
What we've seen this season is nothing different just at an altogether poorer level.

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Post by Michael Foster on Tue Jan 24, 2012 7:40 am

I would not go as far as saying Wenger has lost the plot...but and here comes more buts...

Something has to be done regarding us holding onto 'now just average players'
I don't hold AA responsible for the goal yesterday there was more to blame than just AA,ok it was a half hearted attempt at stopping the attack and he was promptly turned and left for dead...but this is the problem we clearly have players not with minds on other teams or countries just that they clearly don't seam 'up for it' which is what as gooners have become accustomed to over the years (not the recent) out of our men..we used to have a amazing outlook on games and attitude to match were we could simply 'match anybody' and this was not just the comments nor attitude of Mr Wenger but a good 90% of the team...
This has all but disappeared over the last few seasons and been replaced by an attitude of 'good mental strength' and 'togetherness' which seams to a lot of people quite clearly mot the case...you could argue that ok we have a huge injury problem at the mo and there are players with the old die hard attitude..but it's the ones that don't which are hurting the team..now AA has been..well,'been'...song has looked a little distant lately,walcott..well I am getting fed up with trying to defend what he does...I just don't even bother anymore,

these are ment to be senior players and yet don't and are not capable of digging us out of any 'shit'...

AW commented on the fact he took off the ox and replaced him with AA as tho it was a good idea....how many games need to pass before AW actually realises that AA is done.. and he wonders why he took a load of stick for it...

now a lot of people could read this and say well who would you replace AW with and so on...let's just say I don't want him replaced I want him to understand what me,you,the press,everybody is saying...drop the dead wood arsen..it's clear to see and so fucking easy to understand,

Hands in pockets dig out the wallet and splash the cash...we need it,
It will prob go as far as getting the press off his back and getting back to enjoying the game more....
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Post by nick koupparis on Tue Jan 24, 2012 9:27 am


I don't hold AA responsible for the goal yesterday there was more to blame than just AA,ok it was a half hearted attempt at stopping the attack and he was promptly turned and left for dead...

That's why I blame the stoopid fuck-wit ...over running when trying to close the united guy down like a kid in the play ground who can't judge his / her speed. Showing the winger inside (NOT inside you daft prick NOT in side) Russia's capt fek me he is a fekin liability.

As for Mr Wenger I think the guy is loosing the plot seriously.

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